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| | [GP125] All that you wanted to know on Aprilia RSA 125, and more, by Mr Jan Thiel and Mr Frits Overmars (PART 4) | |
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+102barbazan desmofr16 ridley ridgeback luca.valeri.7 vin97 Panas hervefaure Rallyfinnen CVS Apriliabarth melvyn trevor nortumph cassandre pierre95 bengui {mRk} gpracing Larry Wiechman el castor ktuningteam peter1962 Paul Olesen philou Charles Kaneb Motors31 florent.doublet Polinizei dutch Dan42 Makr nine-thirtysix jfn2 Encierro patouille 190mech Seb4LO Mestre Muciek dutch fisher Truls221 Martin1981 nick gill Captain Scarlet Bob van der Zijden seattle smitty CRECY granjoie Maurice Specken Haufen yeahhim m4grity ice t Lef16 Marc motoholic71 alcatelko uniflow gilles27 micowoy bentou yesyes tjbw Paul Gane zeze Toop Ian Harrison senso Tim Ey Ollies930 maccas Filandro Howard Gifford GtG001 pfpraider fpayart Ken Seeber lodgernz oxracer moadoc ambike williamsmotowerx Stephane pagi JanBros GrahamB Senne s brokedown Sanderhoutman LucF Institute of TwoStrokes roost romeuh80 koenich RAW Jan Thiel Forgi Manuel Rainer Piquer Vortex Jarno Frits Overmars 106 participants | |
Auteur | Message |
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Howard Gifford
Nombre de messages : 140 Age : 67 Localisation : Ottawa Canada Date d'inscription : 01/05/2012
| Sujet: Re: [GP125] All that you wanted to know on Aprilia RSA 125, and more, by Mr Jan Thiel and Mr Frits Overmars (PART 4) Mar 25 Aoû 2015 - 15:37 | |
| Here is some section views of the piston assembly. Note the pseuto piston has no rings and transfers all the thrust to clean cylinderwalls with no ports. The actual piston head is bolted to the shaft portion. The whole piston assembly looks a bit heavier than a conventional piston but not a lot when it is all trimmed out to the max [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] |
| | | Dan42
Nombre de messages : 8608 Localisation : Margerie-Chantagret 42 Date d'inscription : 06/04/2014
| Sujet: Re: [GP125] All that you wanted to know on Aprilia RSA 125, and more, by Mr Jan Thiel and Mr Frits Overmars (PART 4) Mar 25 Aoû 2015 - 17:09 | |
| Very interresting design whith " steam engine" pistons, we can suppose that Ryger design is close to this, but without drawings??????? Dan |
| | | Bob van der Zijden
Nombre de messages : 94 Localisation : Hollande Date d'inscription : 10/09/2013
| Sujet: CITS vs RYGER Mar 25 Aoû 2015 - 17:50 | |
| - Dan42 a écrit:
- Very interresting design whith " steam engine" pistons, we can suppose that Ryger design is close to this, but without drawings???????
Dan
Dernière édition par Bob van der Zijden le Lun 14 Sep 2015 - 12:53, édité 1 fois |
| | | Sabijator
Nombre de messages : 12 Age : 39 Localisation : Croatia, Trogir Date d'inscription : 01/07/2011
| Sujet: Re: [GP125] All that you wanted to know on Aprilia RSA 125, and more, by Mr Jan Thiel and Mr Frits Overmars (PART 4) Mer 26 Aoû 2015 - 19:12 | |
| This engine is big riddle but also looks simple Probably: piston is lubricated with oil from crankshaft chamber, so it can have much better lubrication for hi rpms, piston is longer and crank webs(counterweight) have smaller diameter, when piston is in TDC transfers are also closed under the piston-so no mixing crank oil and fuel, upper part of the crankcase looks classic as we can see shape for transfers and oil groove for main bearing, lower piston ring is not close to upper one? Front side of carter is mysterious-something goes there-vacum pump? |
| | | Dan42
Nombre de messages : 8608 Localisation : Margerie-Chantagret 42 Date d'inscription : 06/04/2014
| Sujet: Re: [GP125] All that you wanted to know on Aprilia RSA 125, and more, by Mr Jan Thiel and Mr Frits Overmars (PART 4) Jeu 27 Aoû 2015 - 8:38 | |
| - Sabijator a écrit:
- This engine is big riddle but also looks simple
Probably: piston is lubricated with oil from crankshaft chamber, so it can have much better lubrication for hi rpms, piston is longer and crank webs(counterweight) have smaller diameter, when piston is in TDC transfers are also closed under the piston-so no mixing crank oil and fuel, upper part of the crankcase looks classic as we can see shape for transfers and oil groove for main bearing, lower piston ring is not close to upper one? Front side of carter is mysterious-something goes there-vacum pump? Not certain for a vacum pomp, i think it's the genuine inlet duct connexion of a quite standard crankcase, it looks very similar with VM 125 kart engines ( Czech Rep.) The cylinder also seems very similar, excepted the inlet duct added in a high position. Dan |
| | | yesyes
Nombre de messages : 27 Localisation : nancy Date d'inscription : 25/06/2014
| Sujet: Re: [GP125] All that you wanted to know on Aprilia RSA 125, and more, by Mr Jan Thiel and Mr Frits Overmars (PART 4) Jeu 27 Aoû 2015 - 11:42 | |
| Hello,
Considering the Ryger engine picture and if the large crankcase volume is not longer connected with the cylinder and intake track, the different maximum volumes of the elements implicated in " the helmoltz blues of Frits Overmars " ( intake, tansfer ducts, cylinder ) look nearly the same.
It could also ease the global breathing in shortening the travel of the fresh charge and allow some sort of 4 stroke lubrification for the crankshaft.
Does this kind of balance between the maximum volumes of each part play a role in the working efficiency of the globality ?
Thank you |
| | | Phytus
Nombre de messages : 646 Localisation : Monségur Date d'inscription : 22/06/2012
| Sujet: Re: [GP125] All that you wanted to know on Aprilia RSA 125, and more, by Mr Jan Thiel and Mr Frits Overmars (PART 4) Jeu 27 Aoû 2015 - 15:36 | |
| I can't understand 30000rpm with a "standard" 54mm stroke. What about the piston speed?! It's quite over 26m/s ... The acceleration will be awsome at TDC or BDC isn't? |
| | | Frits Overmars
Nombre de messages : 2611 Age : 75 Localisation : Raalte, Holland Date d'inscription : 12/10/2010
| | | | Dan42
Nombre de messages : 8608 Localisation : Margerie-Chantagret 42 Date d'inscription : 06/04/2014
| Sujet: Re: [GP125] All that you wanted to know on Aprilia RSA 125, and more, by Mr Jan Thiel and Mr Frits Overmars (PART 4) Jeu 27 Aoû 2015 - 18:53 | |
| Sure, if I don't make a mistake, at 30000Rpm, with a piston +crankpin of 200gr, the connecting rod supports tension and compression loads of around 3700 daN, incredible on such small 125cc parts. 200gr is probably wrong: too light. Dan |
| | | Phytus
Nombre de messages : 646 Localisation : Monségur Date d'inscription : 22/06/2012
| Sujet: Re: [GP125] All that you wanted to know on Aprilia RSA 125, and more, by Mr Jan Thiel and Mr Frits Overmars (PART 4) Ven 28 Aoû 2015 - 11:18 | |
| Yes ?! ... It's awsome or it's "here" that we must seek an answer idea? |
| | | Phytus
Nombre de messages : 646 Localisation : Monségur Date d'inscription : 22/06/2012
| Sujet: Re: [GP125] All that you wanted to know on Aprilia RSA 125, and more, by Mr Jan Thiel and Mr Frits Overmars (PART 4) Ven 28 Aoû 2015 - 11:34 | |
| - Dan42 a écrit:
- Sure, if I don't make a mistake, at 30000Rpm, with a piston +crankpin of 200gr, the connecting rod supports tension and compression loads of around 3700 daN, incredible on such small 125cc parts. 200gr is probably wrong: too light.
Dan Tu obtiens ça comment?! Il y a accélération et décélération à chaque point mort ... ------- [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] |
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| Sujet: Re: [GP125] All that you wanted to know on Aprilia RSA 125, and more, by Mr Jan Thiel and Mr Frits Overmars (PART 4) | |
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| | | | [GP125] All that you wanted to know on Aprilia RSA 125, and more, by Mr Jan Thiel and Mr Frits Overmars (PART 4) | |
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